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Det3 Install And Setup


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#1 Matt642322

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 09:35 PM

Firstly mods if this is in the wrong place please move.

My Experience Installing and Setting up a DET3


Disclaimer - this thread is NOT A HOW TO it is simply a record of my experience of installing, setting up, and possibly tuning (we'll see how it goes) a DET3. I have no experience of doing this sort of thing before. If you replicated anything in this thread and your car blows up you were warned


One other thing is a lot of the content that will end up in this thread will have come from other places / forums / posts, I AM NOT claiming all of this as my own, I will do my best where I use other people's info to give them credit but that's not always going to be possible, if it's a random post on a FB group I don't really want to put a person's name in this thread without asking. I will give a shout out right now to noisymini his website and thread on this forum have really helped me get started on this project, in all honesty the ECU would still be in a box in my garage without his content, he has a website it's worth checking out just google noisymini.

I've owned my MX5 for just coming up to 5 years now it is my first fun car, and ever since I bought it I had dreamed of turbo charging it, I discovered mighty car mods by looking up turbo mx5s on Youtube. Now when I first started this endeavor I did not have the money to pay 95% of what I paid for the whole car on a standalone ECU, and I leaned towards the DET3 because of it's semi-standalone "Fuel Implant Technology", and so I bought a second hand but unused unit off Ebay. After I got that I decided that I wanted to build a as complete a set-up as possible with a really strict budget, and started buying parts. Unfortunately because of a new job I've spent a lot of time over the last five years living away from home and my beloved 5, so I never got to do my dream budget turbo build.

Due to this current pandemic I've been at home for three months and finally work on the five has resumed, and although now I am in a position to increase my budget, I spent so many hours dreaming about my car, imagining how I could be smart and frugal with buying used OEM parts from other cars and create something truly reliable but on a modest budget. I just feel like I need to complete this project how I imagined it and then if it all goes Pete Tong everyone can say we told you so and have a giggle.

So without anymore beating round the bush I'll just jump right into it.
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#2 Matt642322

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 10:26 PM

A couple more ground rules my car is a pre-facelift 99 NB, I have found posts saying that the ECU's in the 99-00 cars are a bit different in their reaction to piggybacking to the mk1 and newer mk2 ECU's I can not confirm or deny as I have a sample size of one. But everything in this thread will be for a 99-00 nb, it may work for other models it may not.

 

Also to keep the terminology consistent, if I say ECU I am refering to the stock ECU, I will not refer to the DET3 as an ECU, mostly I'll just use DET.

 

 

 

 

 

The Plan & Where I Am Up To

 

  1. Buy a DET
  2. Find Wiring Diagrams & Pinouts
  3. Read the Manuals
  4. Re-read the Manuals
  5. Decide on Piggyback or Fit
  6. Wire in Power & Ground
  7. Fire up the unit & upgrade firmware
  8. General Settings Input
  9. Intercept a signal wire
  10. Intercept more signal wires
  11. Send ignition to the DET and the out put the the ECU
  12. Send MAF to the DET and the output to the ECU
  13. MAF to MAP conversion & delete MAF
  14. Wire in Wideband - I am working on this bit
  15. Log AFR's on stock system 
  16. Wire stock injectors to DET
  17. Find idle and get AFR to where it was before
  18. Build a FIT controlled injector fuel map based on old MAF to MAP fuel table
  19. Swap to RX8 Yellow injectors 
  20. Find idle and get AFR to where it was before
  21. Build a large injector FIT fuel map based on small injector map
  22. Bolt on Turbo
  23. Find idle and get AFR to where it was before
  24. Build FIT fuel map based on small injector map
  25. Build ignition map  - I am worried about this bit
  26. Cry in joy that this pain is all over

 

UPDATE (25/07/20)

 

As it stands I have the wide band installed with narrow band simulation, and it was giving me lots of issues, I believe because there is an exhaust leak which is effecting the signal at low speeds. So I had to get the car up on axle stands, which is a pain for me because of the uneven ground I have to work with at home. 

 

While I was fixing the exhaust I found out I have been asked to return to the office for work which means relocating again, so it has drastically shortened my time frame for getting this project done before it comes back to a screeching halt. 

 

With that in mind, I have gone ahead and just started getting the turbo on, I fabbed a manifold, and down pipe, and all the plumbing and inter cooler pipework, I still need to install an IAT, boost line, and recirc valve into the intercooler piping. I also need to plumb my boost controller and then install the injectors. Once that is done I'll flush the oil and coolant as the car has been sat for a while. 

 

Obviously this means that steps 15 to 21 have gone out the window, the new plan is get everything on, and try to get the car to run as best I can and get it to a tuner most likely, I'm not sure, it's all a bit in limbo now.

 

However I have more to add to this thread to bring it up to where I am at, and I'll keep on tracking how far I get.


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#3 Matt642322

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 10:44 PM

1. Buy a DET

 

So surprisingly here is the first pitfall that I think you can fall into, there are different versions of the DET3, now they may not all be available anymore but this is just my understanding of things, you had two with built in MAP sensors and then one without.

 

I purchased a 250kpa model, which from speaking to people on the ECU Master FB page, it can handle up to 20psi of boost. There is a 400kpa version (IMHO if you're running more that 20psi a DET isn't really the best solution) which can handle a lot more boost, and then the one without a MAP sensor.

 

If you're new to this take it from me pay for the MAP sensor and pay the extra for the terminated wires it will make your life so much easier:

  1. The colours of the terminated wires all match the wiring diagrams put out by ECU Master
  2. You wont need to find the correct size pins and faff around putting them on, to attach the wires to the DET connector
  3. All the wiring diagrams I found are for a DET with a built in MAP sensor, plus it's all wired internally so it's one less thing to mess up.

Now I got lucky, I had no idea about this stuff and I bought mine as new off someone on fleabay and mine happened to have a built in MAP sensor and terminated wires, I didn't even know there were options at the time, so I really lucked out there.


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#4 Matt642322

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 11:22 PM

2. Find Wiring Diagrams & Pinouts

For the pinouts I used three sources to cross reference each other to make sure I had everything correct:

For the pinout diagram on Turbo Kitty is the clearest and I found the orientation of the pins on diagram made the most sense, they seem to be the opposite way to the pinout diagram in excel file on the ECU Master google drive, I guess it depends on which way you're looking at the connector? I don't know, but the Turbo kitty one made the most sense to me and had the colours of the wires going to the ECU on the diagram which I found invaluable (They are at the very bottom of the MS3X Assembly page).

I also couldn't find the MAF signal pin on either of those diagrams but found a full wiring diagram on the rusefi website, there is a lot of info on it but you can work it out, the MAF is on the very bottom of the chart, and is roughly in the centre. you can then trace back the LTGRN/BLK signal wire to find it goes to the pin 2L.



For the wiring diagrams, you'll find the one in the FIT mode manual is not quite how you want it wired. My start point was from noisyminis site although I found the image of the FIT wiring through google and can't find a related post for to it, the piggyback diagram is at the bottom of the wiring thread.

I utilised the his piggyback and FIT mode wiring diagrams to get me started, but in the end I had to find my own method (more of that later), but for now see the links to the two diagrams that I used, and I'll post an edited version of what I ended up running to start with below.

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#5 Matt642322

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 11:29 PM

Modified Wiring I Ended Up Running Pre MAF to MAP Conversion

 

65d403df39880033ef2195d1f08af3fc.jpg

 

 

Wiring After MAF to MAP Conversion & Wideband install with Narrowband Simulation

 

87def1d5004d5adab84a22ec86728d40.jpg

Modified DET3 wiring for a 99-00 NB MX5


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#6 Matt642322

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 11:49 PM

3. Read the Manuals

 

There are two manuals you will find them both here: https://www.ecumaste...al-ecu-tuner-3/

 

Digital-ECU-Tuner-III-Manual-English = Piggyback Client (software)

Digital-ECU-Tuner-III-FIT-Manual-English = Fuel Implant Client (software)

 

READ THEM BOTH LOTS OF TIMES!!!!

 

I really could just end it there to be honest, but there are small details that are in each one which are not in the other, so trust me read them, google things you don't understand and read them again. It's boring, the stuff doesn't make sense, the English isn't amazing, the updates to the firmware mean they are ever so slightly different in wording to the clients sometimes. But reading and reading the manuals will mean that when you start googling things it makes more sense. 

 

 

4. Re-Read the Manuals!!!

 

Seriously stop being lazy, give one episode of love island or gogglebox a miss and just read the manuals.


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#7 Matt642322

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 12:45 AM

5. Piggyback vs FIT

So this was the burning question I had do you run piggyback or FIT? I know homeworldfusion on here went FIT, I've read a LOT of posts of people going piggyback and giving up, and my main source of reference was noisymini who was using "piggyback wiring" but running it the FIT client. It was all very confusing to me so I will try my best to lay out the differences for you here.



Software Differences
Tables:

  • Piggyback = 1 x fuel table, 2 x PWM tables (I'll be honest I'm not sure what these do yet), 1 x ignition table
  • FIT Mode = 1 x fuel table, 1 x VE (I'll be honest I'm not sure what this does properly yet), 1 x ignition table

Menus:

  • Piggyback = More Configuration menus
  • FIT = SA Fuel Implant menu (inc. tables switch input option)



Wiring Differences

Let's start off with the easy bit, the wiring for Piggyback or FIT is basically the same, except in FIT you wire in the injectors, in piggyback you don't. Technically you have more options with the piggyback wiring as you can assign the analog inputs 1-4 to whatever you want, however in FIT mode inputs 1-4 have fixed assignments you can't change them:



Analog #1 - Throttle Position Sensor (TPS)

Analog #2 - MAP Sensor

  • if you have a built in MAP sensor do not plug anything into pin 14 of the DET
  • if you don't have a built in MAP sensor wire your MAP into pin 14 of the DET

Analog #3 - Coolant Temperature Sensor (CLT)

Analog #4 - Intake Air Temperature Sensor (IAT)


In my opinion if it makes no difference in piggyback which way you wire it then why would you wire it any other way than to match the FIT mode inputs unless you really have to, keeping your assignments the same just allows you to try both modes (sort of) and not have to change the wiring. Unless you have other inputs you want to put in I think your best wiring the way I've said. Also be aware you will see in my wiring diagram the MAF goes to the map (mapping table map) switch, this is becuase in the FIT Client ONLY you can wire a fifth input into the map switch and tell the DET how you want it to treat the signal, in my wiring I used "Use as analog input".

 

349ea9bb0afc415fff5f7d6d5a5526dd.jpg

 

 

Is it really one vs the other?

From the information that is out there I think people think that FIT is an all or nothing situation, that you wire it in FIT and have to build a base map from scratch. From reading noisymini's threads and my own testing, it seems you can run with no injectors in the FIT client more or less the same as in the piggyback client. I can't confirm yet as I messed up my logs by not having the fuel table set correctly (more of that later), but at this point I think you can pretty much use the piggyback set-up in my wiring diagram above, to get a MAF to MAP conversion (more of that later), delete the MAF input from the map switch pin, wire in a wideband (more of that later) and use the the logging to get a rough idea of your AFR's vs the piggyback fuel table, these values should really help you to get your proper FIT fuel map in the ball park when it comes time to fully switch to FIT mode by wiring the injectors to the DET. I'm sure that was clear as mud, and some of that is just my own theory, but as I go through the next few stages hopefully I'll be proven right, that explanation will become clear, and it should make the FIT mode seem less of a daunting task.


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#8 Matt642322

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 01:40 AM

6. Wiring In Power & Ground



BEFORE YOU START GET A MULTIMETER!!!!


Seriously, I didn't before I started, it was a stupid thing to do, and they only cost £10 from the local tool shop, you can definitely wire the DET in without one, but you won't be able to troubleshoot your problems when they arise, which they most certainly will.

you will need cutters, wire strippers, and crimp pliers and connectors, I personally think it is the easiest way to get it wired in and make changes if you have to, once you're happy with the wiring and you know it will not have to ever change then solder the tail of the wire to the crimp connector (make sure to leave some wire sticking out of the top the of connector to do this).



When reading the wiring diagrams I was confused by the lines which went to both computers, were these signals going to both, were they signals going from the DET to the ECU, or signals from the ECU to DET. Technically they could be any of those three, however if you look at what the wire is and think about what your trying to do with the information from that signal it becomes clearer where they should go, also the FIT manual clearly tells you which wires are common and therefore need to go to both computers, but I will be going through it in detail in this thread so if you're unsure just keep reading.

As an example of my above point in this diagram from the FIT manual, the TPS, CLT, & IAT, look the same as the analog out (pin 17) to ECU MAF sensor in but they are not, the first three are analog inputs shared by both and so you need to intercept the wire, my choice is piggback crimp connectors. The later is an output of DET being wired from the DET, to the ECU. and is taking the signal from the MAF sensor in (pin2) and altering it before sending it to the ECU.

 

 

 

2b042928592038bb932c2795554901b8.jpg

 

 

 

Unhook your battery BEFORE you start chopping wires!!

 

I have been told this in the past, I do not know if it's true, but it's a rule I stick to, before I unplug an ecu connector, cut a wire, change the which crimp connector is connected to what, I always unhook the battery, is it a faff when you're changing through configurations, of course, but I would rather that than risk damaging my wiring, ECU, or the DET.

Cutting into my harness was a scary thought, I really didn't want to do it, I looked at building a loom extension but the time and cost involved made me just man up and start chopping wires. First you need your power and ground:

  • +12V Power = ECU pin 1B White wire with red stripe in connector 1 - this goes to pin 1 of the DET
  • Ground = ECU pin pin 3A Black wire with yellow stripe in connector 3 - this goes to pin 11 of the DET

 

(side note: on the DET the pins are in two rows, 1-10 & 11-20, the higher numbers are on the top row, as you face the bottom of the connector with the retention clip facing the ceiling, the last digit will always be the same, so 16 is above 6, 13 is above 3 and so on)

 

 

668b54531f728e8dc549e992e9808651.jpg


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#9 Matt642322

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 05:32 PM

7. Fire up the unit & upgrade firmware

 

Once the ground and +12v are wired in, hook up the battery, plug the USB cable from the DET into your computer and open up the DET PIGGYBACK CLIENT, the first time you do this it has to be the piggyback client as you need to upgrade the firmware of the device to allow it to work with the FIT client. Once you have the piggyback client open, turn your ignition on, if you've wired your ground and power correctly your laptop will bing as it recognises a new device.

 
Frustratingly YOU CANNOT CONNECT THE DET TO THE CLIENT WITHOUT POWERING IT FROM THE +12V & GROUND OF THE CAR. It seems crazy to me the unit can't power off the USB and allow you to connect it to the client and upgrade the firmware, or in my case as my unit was second hand (although sold as unused) even check it works until you start wiring it in.
 

In the piggbyback client once you turn the ignition on, you will also see at the bottom the client will say connected, if it says cannot connect then there is an issue with your power and ground.

 

0c9f5f0174e013436c7f3ccba4ca5d47.jpg

 

 

Once you do connect go to the file menu and upgrade the firmware, you will not be able to do this either if the DET is not connected properly as the upgrade button in the upgrade menu will be greyed out.

Once you have upgraded the firmware, click the make maps permanent button:

 

a123a403c888e289d9f2c9de1a815f79.jpg

 

 

Then go file and save project as, it is a good idea to save a new version each time you make a change so you can always go back to a point you were at before. You can now turn off the ignition, and close the piggbyback client. Open the FIT client, and then repeat this whole process. Now you can operate the DET from either client as you need.


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#10 Matt642322

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 07:27 PM

8. General Settings Input

Once you fire up the DET, and connect it to the client there are some basic settings you are going to want to put into the set up. To get me started I downloaded from the ECU Master site a base map for my car found in the same place as the pinout diagrams. You can open most files in notepad, their EMU Black base map is no different. Once I opened the file I used Ctrl+F to search for the terms for some of the inputs I was looking for, a good example would be things like injector size where you search for injector and a couple of hits in find injector size:

 

 

e01a21fa610660a23b10ddcbb0785d93.jpg

 

 

 

These are my general settings for FIT mode, quite a few of these came from the EMU base map file:

 

 

 

23e78014b225d757b2bc08441da7256e.jpg

 

 

 

 

Some of the virtual dyno settings can also be pulled out of the EMU base map file too. I have not input my gear ratio, driving axle ratio, or transmission losses yet. So don't copy from the image below, also if anyone know's these values please could you let me know.

 

 

 

2a00669464c98d0b1e48b339826b14e1.jpg

 

 

 

If you're running in the piggyback client now is a good time to set your scales configuration, now this is completely dependant on how you wire it so I can't give you any help with this other than to say the ones below are roughly what you need if you follow my wiring model. If you're using the FIT client then you will have to set this up but not yet, and you'll only have one to do not four. Also there is an annoying quirk to the way both clients work, where it is really easy to not save these properly and have to keep redoing it, when I first started playing with them it drove me mad!
 

 

 

a0fd6ed6b46e63f8bb8b245c3e43b28a.jpg

 

 

 

The key to this is you have to click load next to the input you want to set, then select the correct scale from the default list, it's very much trial and error with this as the names of the files are not always that obvious as to what kind of sensor scale they are, some are obvious they say MAP sensor or temperature sensor, but not all of them. Get all your scales set for each input. You then need to click save in the bottom left, then give your set up a name like MX5_SCALES, and click save. TAKE NOTICE your file in the default scales will NOT have changed, what you then need to do is after you save the configuration file, click load on the right of the default scales, find the file you just saved, click load then okay, then you must make your maps permanent and save your project. This annoyingly fan-dangled way of doing this is the only way I could find to make the correct scales come up when I connected the DET to the client, if I do didn't follow this procedure exactly my scales kept resetting to the default and it was painfully annoying.

 

I would say that these are really all the settings you need to just get started and anything else you can set as you go.


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#11 Matt642322

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 08:44 PM

9. Intercept a Signal Wire

Now we start getting into the meat of it, time to really start chopping and splicing. Like the Ground and 12+v the next easiest things to do is to connect the common signals these are your TPS, IAT, & CLT. so first we need the correct pins, now again I would suggest following the FIT wiring even if you think you'll go piggyback, as you can still change your mind later and you won't have to change the wiring.

Personally I would start with the TPS, reason being is it's the easiest to check that it's working, press the throttle peddle if your signal changes your at least in the ball park.


  • TPS = ECU pin 3E Green wire with black stripe in connector 3 - this goes to pin 13 of the DET

First you'll cut the TPS signal wire, you're then left with three ends to join the two ends for the wire you just cut and the third being the wire that goes to the pin of the DET. You crimp one female, one male, and one piggyback, spade connector to each of these three ends and now you can join all three together and run a signal to both the ECU and the DET. Once you have done this when you look at the TPS signal in the FIT client (or whichever analog input you've wired it to for piggyback) you will see that when you depress the accelerator with the ignition on your TPS signal will go between roughly 10-80% or 0.5-3.5 volts on a multimeter, or at least mine does.

 

f0767c9a4e856a173ab7b061cfc448fe.jpg

 


A quick lesson I learnt, some of you may have seen my other post DET3 TPS Signal Issue, and seen that "I solved the problem", well no that was a complete red herring. See this post to see the issue I had: https://www.mx5nutz....howtopic=388059

Safe to say it was not the broken connector that caused the issue, as after trying to wire in the IAT the TPS decided to stop working again and I had to dig a little deeper. The actual cause of my problem was not having the ECU connectors plugged into the ECU, if someone can tell me why this is the case I'd love to know, but if I disconnect the ecu connectors, and turn the ignition on the signal from the TPS just stays at around 0.2-0.8v, as soon as the connectors are plugged into the ECU it goes back to 0.5-3.5v. Now I don't know if this is true for all the sensors, I didn't bother trying to find out, I just made sure to plug my connectors back into my ECU before I tested any of my wiring.


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#12 Matt642322

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 09:22 PM

10. Intercept more signal wires

So once you're happy with this signal, you can look to do the exact same process for the IAT & CLT sensors.


  • IAT = ECU pin 2B Pink wire with blue stripe in connector 2 - this goes to pin 16 of the DET
  • CLT = ECU pin 2E Red wire with blue stripe in connector 2 - this goes to pin 15 of the DET

The way I checked these two sensors was to click on the log window in the FIT client, when you then start the car up, you will see any inputs that are wired to the DET or any other information it can infer from those signals, i.e. RMP is calculated from the ignition parameters and the crank sensor input, as lines on the graph.

1) IAT is shown as a solid pink line, 2) CLT is a dotted red line, see below:

 

 

74dec25c185f09eb0c2cef32eaaaf6a5.jpg

 

 

 

After I took that screen shot I found a trick which I didn't know you could do before hand, as we are trying to wire in the IAT & CLT we just want to focus on those signal inputs, all the other lines are just noise. So right click at any point on the graph and you will see the options show all and hide all. this allows you to remove all the graph lines or bring them all back at once. So click the hide all option, now go down to the IAT, CLT buttons on the bottom left of the window (highlighted in yellow) and click them, this will add those lines to the graph, to remove them again just click the button again.

Doing this is really helpful for looking at one or two signals in isolation (I will demonstrate this a bit later on), with the IAT and CLT you are expecting the IAT to start at ambient outside temperature, for me it was roughly 20°c , and my CLT was around 13°C. On start up you will immediately start to see the CLT temperature begin to climb while at idle the AIT should remain fairly constant. If you see readings which seem sensible in the logs you probably have these wired in correctly. Now there is a proper calibration process, but at this point I have not yet tried it. I probably should look at it, particularly the IAT as I think from the manual it says it is fairly critical for the FIT calculations, I will need to address this soon, but trying to understand sensor calibration just doesn't seem that exciting


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#13 Matt642322

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 10:18 PM

11. Ignition Part 1

Okay so now things are going to get a little more tricky, and it's at this point the information in this thread is going to get a lot more 99-00 nb specific. I have read of people doing this different ways to what I did, however I will go through what happened for me, and how I got this to work. I am hoping that this method will work for any pre-facelift NB, I can't see why it wouldn't but if it doesn't or it doesn't work for your model of car, if you follow the first steps I did, you should be able to share information with ECU Master and they will most likely be able to help. I've been in contact with them via FB messenger, and they have offered to look at my tables once I get the MAF to MAP done, so I'm sure if you were stuck they would be able to help.

Okay first go and read the ignition portions of both the manuals, it's okay I'll wait........ No go and read them!....... Okay fine don't.

So I never knew that were so many different ignition timing methods, and they are all pretty similar but annoyingly different. So to begin with I just googled around looking for the correct settings for the ignition configuration, and the issue is that the ignition configurations for MK1's and MK2's are different. From my googling I believe the MK1's use both a cam angle sensor and a crank angle sensor and the MK2's only use a crank angle sensor, please correct me if I'm wrong I found this whole topic extremely confusing.

After a google around I saw some info saying that the mx5 had a hall effect type sensor, and a four tooth trigger wheel, so I looked at the options in the client and saw there was one for retard / advance multitooth signal with four or more teeth per revolution. That seemed to fit the bill as far as I could tell so I punted for that and set the sensor to hall effect. After setting my RPM, I figured four teeth meant four signals, and I just left the maximum retard and advance alone.

 

d76214dc17759b3201822c57ec307295.jpg

 

 

Okay this is where I went wrong, I am going to walk you though what I did next and how I found the solution, for clarity the way I wired the DET was correct, but my settings were wrong.
 

  • Crank In = ECU pin 2J Grey wire with Red stripe in connector 2 - this goes to pin 9&8 of the DET
  • Crank Out = DET pin 6 - this goes back to ECU pin 2J Grey wire with Red stripe in connector 2

 

Now reading noisymini's thread I saw he had used the pullup resistor pin in his wiring for the ignition so I figured I would do the same too. So I took my terminated ignition in pin 9 of the DET and the pullup resistor pin 8 of the DET, twisted the two wires together and added a connector. I spliced into the ignition signal for the crank sensor and I connected the sensor side to the ignition in and pullup wires, and then connected the ECU side of the crank signal wire to the ignition out pin 6 of the DET.

I hooked up the battery and tried to start the car, it fired up and immediately and then died, I tried a couple more times with the same result, the car clearly did not like the set-up I was using. I decided to cut the pullup wire to see if that would fix the issue, but with the pullup wire removed the car wouldn't even turn over.

 

Now this was the first time the car wouldn't start since I'd started chopping wires and to say I panicked would be an understatement, I wanted to immediately go back to how it was before but because of the connectors I'd used my signal wire had a male connector at both ends because I worked off the idea if I kept all my DET3 connectors the same it would make it clearer when looking at it later on, I happened to choose female. The result was that in this situation my signal wire now had a male at both ends, so to get round this I found some scrap wire in the garage and made a couple of these piggyback jumper leads to allow me to run different configurations of wires easily.

 

2193687d22862f554dd60a2cd7f5fc61.jpg

 

 

Once I removed the signal going to the DET and wired it back to the stock ECU input the car started first time with no issues, which was a relief.
 


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#14 Matt642322

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 10:58 PM

11. Ignition Part 2

So with the wiring set up how it's supposed to be the car will start but not run. I was a little bit lost as to what to do, I decided to go back to the manuals, and re-read them to see if I could find a clue in there. Here is why you need to read both manuals, although I am trying to run FIT the answer I needed was in the piggyback manual and utilised the piggyback client, so this is why I keep saying it's not really a choice of one over the other, and really I think ECU Master would have been better off creating a single software but hey ho it is what it is.

To try to find anything I could on the ignition system in both manuals I used Ctrl+F and searched for ignition, and in the piggyback manual right at the end was a page on the scope function. This is a tool BUILT ONLY INTO THE PIGGYBACK CLIENT, It allows you to analyse the ignition signal input which will help you understand the settings you require. First go to the ignition configuration settings and change the mode to scope.




172118314214b307053b517a5eb2840f.jpg



To make this work I needed to get an ignition input signal to the DET, now the manual says the scope function will replicate the input signal from the sensor and send it to the ECU and allow the car to run, this was not the case for me.

However I was able to use my piggyback jumpers to first try wiring in the signal wire to the ECU and then to the Ign in and pullup on the DET. In this configuration the car fired up but still died quickly, so again I tried removing the pullup.

Now just to make this really clear, at this point I had the ignition wire, set up like one of my other signal wires, i.e. I was spliced into the ignition in signal wire, but it was also still going to the ECU. I tried turning it over and the car immediately fired up and I could see data in the log window, it was also at this point I noticed my RPM figures were double what they were on my tachometer.

 

I then read the settings more closely and realised the number of signals were per every two rotations, so with four teeth that meant eight signals. I changed this setting and my RMP figure came back in line with the clock on the dash.  

Now I was able to go into the piggyback client go to the tools menu and scope, I clicked get data and this is what came up

 

b62b79b7c1b5dcc62002144a28281cc9.jpg

 

 

I couldn't make any sense of it but I tried pressing zoom in about six or seven times and then this image became clear, I could clearly see the pulses of the crank angle sensor as the trigger wheel teeth passed it.

 

9223a6e5555e38c515663c4e62c2b6ed.jpg

 

 

Now I noticed from this graph the pulse width was not even, the pulse gap pattern was wide, narrow, wide, narrow.

 

d303ecba4989902f2f8b6206ba9915a9.jpg



This wasn't conclusive but gave me a starting point at least. 


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#15 Matt642322

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 11:32 PM

11. Ignition Part 3

With the information about the uneven pulse widths, I tried googling without any real info coming to light, I'm not sure why I just decided to do a searched for a picture of the trigger wheel, and once I did that I could clearly see the issue and why my ignition settings weren't working. This again may or may not be true for your mx5 it is at least true for my 99-00, when I found the piture of the trigger wheel I could see the teeth are not evenly spaced. I was expecting the wheel to look like a clock face with teeth at 12, 3, 6, & 9, when in reality it's closer to 12, 4, 6, & 10, see below.





301b8f1e22fb77e097c9cbd71e4a3806.jpg


If you compare back to the trigger pulses on the scope graph you can see where the wheel is passing between the small and large gaps in the teeth. The software quite clearly says multitooth is for when the angular distance between teeth is consistent, I just assumed they were even when they weren't giving the ECU the wrong signal.

 

8b1fb9f6f9bcaad1eec60d1485a41de7.jpg



So I knew what the problem was but had no way to fix it, fortunately someone of the ECU Master FB group put me on to a post on there which had the settings in it. The post said you needed to use the mode EDIS SAW Signal Absolute, and the descirption said it was a Ford ignition system. I've tried googling what EDIS SAW is but I don't really understand it. However trust me if you have the same setup I do, the ignition configuration below is what you need:

 

aa8097ffcb0f15835c86215f4a092448.jpg



Okay so now I returned my wiring to how I originally had it, i.e. crank singal into the ignition in pin 9 and pullup pin 8 of the DET, then DET ignition out pin 6 to the pin 2J of the ECU. Turned the key and the car instantly fired into life. I was so please I could not even tell you, having gone from the car not starting to working great and the signal going through the piggyback system really felt like a turning point as I started to realised this was something even a complete novice like me could gradually work out.


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#16 Matt642322

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Posted 25 July 2020 - 11:20 AM

12. MAF Input

So now I had the ignition setup I moved onto the MAF signal.

FIT VS PIGGYBACK AGAIN

I know I keep banging on about this but you need to know that to run the set up I am running we need to use the map switch as an analogue input, you can only do this in the FIT client, the menu for setting the table switch configuration is under the SA Fuel Implant menu.

Note: You could run MAF and do the conversion to MAP in the piggyback client, however you would have to sacrifice one of your other analogue inputs, wire the MAF in to it's input, and update the scales configuration, if you were doing it that way I think you would have to swap out the CLT input as all the others are required for the conversion although don't quote me on that.


FOR MY SET UP I HAD TO DEVIATE FROM THE MANUALS

So I followed the manuals and wired how they suggested and it was a complete failure, so I worked out my own way to do the MAF input then conversion to MAP. So I hope this makes sense as I will go through the way I did it in order, I'll try to make it clear when I'm doing it the way the manual says and then how I ended up doing it. With that out the way let's continue.


So to begin with I used the reusefi diagram to find the MAF sensor pin, it's at the bottom in the middle of the diagram and if you trace the light green black wire back to the ECU it's connector 2L:




3559a87a682a12af984a8045104c2620.jpg


Once I knew this I wired the DET (NOTE: THIS WILL CHANGE):

  • MAF In = ECU pin 2L Light Green wire with Black stripe in connector 2 - this goes to pin 2 of the DET
  • MAF Out = DET pin 17 - this goes back to ECU pin 2L Light Green wire with Black stripe in connector 2

After wiring the MAF in and out into the DET, you need need to open the FIT client connect the DET, go to the SA Fuel Implant menu, then click Tables Switch Input, from the window select Use As Analogue Input (don't forget to save the project and then make the maps permanent to load the settings to the DET).

 

9bf9bfb3972bfa9e7fb02690af6cf6ba.jpg


Once this is done you need to set the scale configuration like I showed for the piggbyback client, however in the FIT client you will see there is only one configurable input which is the map table switch (pin 2). For MAF this needs to be the set to Linear Voltage Scales 0-5v. Again you need to save this new parameter as it's own default otherwise it will keep resetting every time you open the client see the steps part 8 for doing that, but save a new default and load it to the default scales, then save the project and make the maps permanent.

 

4f908fcf5f1d4106b459a2a32dd42a03.jpg



I tried starting the car, it started then died and a couple more tries gave the same result. As before I put my wiring back to how it was before I did this step and the car started fine, so I knew it was an issue with the signal coming from the DET MAF out.

I used my multimeter to check the voltage of the factory setup, it was 1.5v with the ignition on, and 2.0v at idle. This gave me my base line for what I was trying to achieve with the DET3 MAF out. So I rewired the setup as the manual says, and when I checked with the ignition on the voltage was 7.13v, way above the 0-5v input range of the DET. I wondered if maybe in this particular case the MAF needed a pullup like the ignition did, as there are two pullups on the DET I thought it was worth a punt. I added a second wire to the MAF in wire, connecting it to both pin 2 & 3 of the DET my wiring was now as so (NOTE: THIS WILL CHANGE):

  • MAF In = ECU pin 2L Light Green wire with Black stripe in connector 2 - this goes to pin 2&3 of the DET
  • MAF Out = DET pin 17 - this goes back to ECU pin 2L Light Green wire with Black stripe in connector 2

This time the car wouldn't even start so I turned to google, I found posts of other people who had experienced the same issue with other cars. I posted my issue on the ECUMaster Tuning, Tips, and Builds FB page, and a chap came back and said he'd had the same issue on his NB MX5, and had used a 1k resistor to modify the input signal to do his conversion, which leads me to believe there is a built in resistor in the factory ECU which is lost when you wire the MAF in to the DET.

I did some searching to see if a 1k resistor was going to be the right thing, and I found a lot of complicated posts about how to test for resistance, and in all honesty it all went over my head. After having a little think for a while, I thought about how I overcame the ignition input issue, I just piggybacked the signal to get the scope function to work. With the MAF to MAP conversion the MAF output before the conversion isn't really important the calculation would be calculated from the inputs, so was there even a need to wire the MAF out to the ECU???

With this in mind I removed the ignition out and pullup wires, and used one of my jumper cables to join the factory MAF signal back to itself and also output to the DET. I turned the ignition on and checked the voltage, 1.5v, i then started the car, checked the voltage and 2.0v result! So it seems that if you piggyback the MAF signal wire as you would any of other analogue inputs the resistor inside the ECU keeps the signal stable.

So to be clear to get the MAF input to work you will have the wiring as below and this will allow you to run the car and log the data you need to do the MAF to MAP conversion:

  • MAF In = ECU pin 2L Light Green wire with Black stripe in connector 2 - this is intercepted and goes to pin 2 of the DET
  • MAF Out = nothing

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#17 Matt642322

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Posted 25 July 2020 - 01:31 PM

13. MAF to MAP Conversion Part 1

Now that I had my wiring correct I wanted to check that the signal seemed to be sensible before I started trying to do the MAF to MAP conversion, I hooked the laptop up to the DET and took it out for a quick drive, it seemed to drive as it was when it was stock which I was pleased about, in all honesty I wasn't changing anything in the timing and the MAF signial was still going to the stock ECU so it should still be driving like stock.

So after a quick trip to the roundabout at the end of my road and back the logs showed the MAF and RMP values aligned fairly closely which made me feel fairly confident that the MAF values were pretty close.

 

03c58e89160ebc5ce02fdd43abe1258a.jpg

 

Quick Tip: When you finish logging data, and want to review it, all the time the Enable Log box is ticked in the bottom left of the log window you cannot scroll left and right. So once you're done logging, stop uncheck the box and you and scroll through and review your logs. BEWARE you must recheck this box again before you are able to log any new information, don't do what I did and go out to log data and then get home to find this box wasn't checked and all the information hadn't saved. A good way to make sure is to plug the laptop in and fire the car up and just check there is data logging in the window before you head out for a drive.

 

Here is another lesson I learnt the hard way, once you get to safe place to stop, when you turn your ignition off the DET disconnects from the client, IF YOU CLOSE THE CLIENT YOU WILL LOOSE YOUR LOGS.

To avoid this go to File then save logs, also this way, as long as all your settings, scales, and parameters stay the same, you can close the client, come back the next day connect to the DET load the saved project and click File, load log and then any new driving you do will carry on logging from the point you left off. Which means you can build up a decent log without having to go driving for hours at a time.


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#18 Matt642322

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Posted 25 July 2020 - 02:05 PM

13. MAF to MAP Conversion Part 2

Now that I was happy that my MAF signal was mostly correct, it was time to do the MAF to MAP conversion.

 

So giddy as a school kid that I had seemingly got this all wired in correctly I went for a really long drive well over and hour, as it tells you in the manual I tried to get the widest range of loads as I could to give the MAF to MAP algorithm the best chance of working properly. I tried going up and down the gears very slowly at low rpms, I tried thrashing it to red line in as many gears as it was safe to do so, mostly 1st & 2nd. I went up and down hills in low gears and high gears. I also tried to get the very low load range by stopping putting it in 4th gear and gently lifting the clutch and getting the car to almost stall but just stopping it trying to get those very low rpm ranges.

Once this is done, you can turn off the car DON'T CLOSE THE CLIENT, then save your log. Before the conversion you will have a blank fuel table:

 

0a7ee3d7dd9f0ae3bcc45eb9802e3331.jpg

 

Go to your log window right click anywhere on the graph and select MAF to MAP conversion. When you click back to the fuel table you SHOULD have a table that looks like the below, you need to then save the project and then make the maps permanent to load it to the DET.

 

163ee50c8fdf9d62ac9712ae48a977e6.jpg



However the reason I say should is because I then learnt the hard way, before you do this, start the car leave it to get up to temperature, and just do two pulls to redline. This is a terrible way to do the conversion but its a very good way to see if you're about to spend hours of time driving creating a log that is totally worthless, as my first log was:

 

29ea382ec64198d9f49714fc2c8c3cbe.jpg

 

 

I again turned to the ECUMaster build FB page for help on what had gone so wrong with my log and conversion. I was quickly informed that I had not set the load scale properly or configured the MAP sensor input. So I would have to update these and then I could try and do the log again.


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#19 Matt642322

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Posted 25 July 2020 - 03:07 PM

13. MAF to MAP Conversion Part 3

So what had gone wrong is that the load scale the x axis on the fuel table was set to 200kPa, where atmospheric pressure is 100kPa at sea level, which meant that more than half of the fuel table cells were configured for a load the car was never going to see. So I spoke to the guys on the FB group and they agreed 105kPa was a good top level to use for the load range, and in the logs of my failed attempt I saw that the MAP never recorded a value less than 18kPa, so I punted with 15kPa as my lowest value, and updated the load tables.

To do this go to the SA Fuel Implant menu and then general setup, change the MAP voltage until your low and high kPa values are 15 & 105:




e4bd1b6d054eaa13539b88c79b5be718.jpg



After this save your project and make the maps permanent. Now you need to input the configurations for the MAP sensor, go to the SA Fuel Implant menu and then Sensors, MAP Sensor and configure for your MAP sensor this will be different depending on whether you have a unit with a built in MAP sensor either 200kPa or 400kPa or if you're using an external one.

Now I just want to reiterate, do two pulls and check you conversion before you go for a long drive to get your logs, you can do reset the fuel table to 0 and do the conversion again after, but I didn't do that, and found out the hard way AGAIN. This was my fuel table after my second very long drive, with a wide range of loads:

 

7cda20fd6e90b17c3accff11a2afaf7e.jpg



I had misunderstood the advice and configured the MAP sensor wrong, I thought my range had to be 105kPa as that's the most pressure I saw in the logs, but what that did was tell the DET that 5.0v was equal to 105kPa.

Because I have a 250kPa model, 5.0v would be equal to 250kpa, which meant that when the MAP sensor gave a signal of 1.9v when it saw 95kPa, the DET used the calculation (1.9v/5.0v) * 105kPa logging the 1.9v as 40kPa, which you can see is near the highest value recorded in the table above. If I had set the range to 250kPa the calculation would have been (1.9v/5.0v) * 250kPA giving the correct 95kPa.

I'm sure that was clear as mud, so see below the correct settings for the sensor range:

 

1a49e1ba8de8d9ae167b2ba8c0b915ce.jpg



Again lesson learnt, make sure you have everything configured correctly before doing your logs, I lost a good couple of days after work to these errors and spending time driving to get the logs which I couldn't use as I was changing the parameters each time so I couldn't just reuse the old ones.


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#20 Matt642322

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Posted 25 July 2020 - 03:46 PM

13. MAF to MAP Conversion Part 4

So now I had the correct wiring and the correct settings, out I went for a third long drive, and fortunately this time when I did the conversion my fuel table looked like this:



d8237f714779d4c30e3b780710c381ab.jpg



Now it was time to tidy this up a bit, I decided to manually copy the values into excel, as I couldn't find a way to export them in a file type my computer can read, there is a table export in the file menu but it just saves as a file type that only the client can work with, and even opening it in notepad just gives a mess of symbols so I manually typed it all into excel.

 

f5a0937f3046cd1e4717e9ba9cb860ff.jpg

 

 

 

 

I then used the pattern extrapolation in excel to guesstimate the areas that had not been covered by the conversion or to tidy up any values which didn't look correct. After I had done this I was left with the following table:

 

1e869f8abcc824c1641e22c11ddbd61b.jpg


I then had to manually type these new values back into the client, I'm sure this was a very inefficient way to do it, but I'm far more comfortable working in excel, and I could do calculations directly in the file. Also I find the way you enter the values into the client a bit slow I'm sure I could get used to it, you can navigate the selected cells with the arrow keys which is good, but you have to press enter before you type the number and then again to confirm it. Coming from a background using excel a lot I just could not get my head around hitting enter twice and I kept doing it wrong, so I decided to just do it in excel and copy it across.

Finally after that I had a fuel map in the client which looked like this:

 

6fee725cd6180317100975c48f2e96db.jpg


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